On this week's episode of the Building Interest Podcast, Leader Bank's Senior Vice President & Head of Residential Lending, Sean Valiton, discusses Entrepreneurship 101. In this episode, we cover the importance of evolving and changing, surrounding yourself with like-minded people, and how your personal life can teach you to be a better leader. 

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Episode Transcript

Greg Farber:  0:00  
Whether you're seeking inspiration, wisdom or a fresh perspective on leadership and entrepreneurship, the building interest podcast has you covered together. We explore the successes of groundbreaking leaders, the triumphs, the challenges and the invaluable lessons they learned along the way. Our discussions go beyond strategic decision making and delve into the personal hobbies and passions that keep these leaders inspired and grounded in their work. I'm your host. Greg Farber, let's jump right in today. We're joined by Sean Valiton, Senior Vice President and head of Residential Lending here at Leader Bank, a passionate innovator himself with a growth mindset, a family man, an avid skier. Well, we're going to learn a lot more about you. Welcome.

Sean Valiton:  0:36  
Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Greg Farber:  0:38  
So we were going through kind of some show notes and what we want to talk about, and the first thing is this idea that you've been in the business for a long time, and I'm realizing, yep, so have. We were talking before the show. We are getting older. Yeah, I started well over 20 years ago myself. My little notes here say you've been in real estate for more than 20 years now. So tell us a little bit about why you first got into sort of the real estate field as a whole?

Sean Valiton:  1:04  
Sure. Yeah. I mean, I've always been interested in real estate. Going back my neighbor was a real estate agent, and I grew up in a pretty small town and in one house, so we had never, we never really moved. And my neighbor, who was a real estate agent, they moved all the time. And I always found it really interesting 

Greg Farber:  1:22  
They moved, as opposed to helping other people move. 

Sean Valiton:  1:24  
They moved. They moved a lot too. And it was just interesting to me the fact that they like how they chose where they'd moved to, and like their different, the different surroundings, and changing that up, and kind of how people decide on that front. And that person did pretty well too. So that always kind of gave me a sense that real estate agents did well. My dad also always had his real estate license, which was interesting, because he was in travel but, but he always said that it was a good, you know, fall back. You never know if you're gonna have a friend who wants to sell a house and could be a place to make money. So, so I always had kind of upcoming up an interest in real estate from that perspective. And then I was waiting tables through high school and in after college and trying to figure out kind of what I wanted to do with the rest of my life. And I had gotten my real estate license, and I met this awesome group of people at a bar, actually, who this, this woman, Karen O'Connor, who ran Paragon Properties, their operations. And she was like, you have to work for us. And so I went in, and it was this boutique. 

Greg Farber:  2:26  
You hadn't worked in real estate before this. 

Sean Valiton:  2:27  
I hadn't worked in real estate. 

Greg Farber: 2:28  
You had your license, but you hadn't actually worked in it? 

Sean Valiton:  2:30  
Right. So I was just, I was waiting tables.

Greg Farber: 2:32  
And you had this lifelong view of real estate agents just buying houses and moving all the time.

Sean Valiton:  2:37  
Yep, exactly. And, but I really like, like spaces and property and just in general, okay, the whole reason behind why people choose to live where they choose to live, and so this firm in particular was really interesting because it was a rental firm in the city, and they specialized in lofts and like these really cool, like warehouse type spaces, 

Greg Farber:  3:01  
Newly renovated stuff? Ok. 

Sean Valiton:  3:03  
And they had built this great business around that where, you know, people who were looking for funky spaces in the city would come to them to find rentals. And so I got involved with them and learned the city. Learned kind of how to really grind, get out, show people property. 

Greg Farber:  3:19  
You say the city? This was here in Boston? 

Sean Valiton:  3:20  
This is here in Boston. And so I did that in my early 20s, and just really fell in love with it, and started to think about selling property as well, and just this whole idea around, you know, what goes into choosing where you want to live and the different spaces that you have options for, and so taught me a lot about it. I just had this interest in the business in general.

Greg Farber:  3:43  
Do you feel like, I know you mentioned there was a lot of rental space, obviously, as opposed to the buying and selling, which transitions later on into your current life in the mortgage business. But any kind of really key takeaways or lessons about that industry, and what you felt like you learned from that, that then you could move forward and apply as you maybe move into the next chapter of your career?

Sean Valiton:  4:04  
Sure, yeah. I mean, I think that that specific time frame and beginning of my career in the real estate business taught me a lot around grit and grind and, you know, putting in, running around with people and how much it takes to be able to to make a success, especially in that, as far as rentals go, is a really difficult you have to do a lot. You don't make very much money, and then so then, as I started getting to more of the sales side of it, just realized that it is really a game of of putting yourself out there, meeting people and trying to get you know more buyers and help them. But the thing that really interested me about real estate in general was the kind of people behind it, the buyers, such an important piece of your life, whether that's whether you're renting a new apartment or buying a new house. Where you live, is such a key critical piece to who you are and where you are in your life. And that's what really interested me about the business in general. And as I got into being an agent and showing people houses and helping them buy them, and then started to learn the lending side of the business and the title side of the business, and kind of this whole ecosystem that goes around the purchase of a super important piece of somebody's life, I just got more and more interested in it, and as I learned more about the different angles of it, I realized how much more there was to learn, and then how much we could impact people's lives by creating this better experience.

Greg Farber: 5:38  
So I want to come back to the grit a bit later, but we were talking offline, and you had mentioned even just the time that you just talked about being in restaurant out of college, really kind of is where you started to feel that you had a passion for people and the things you were just saying about that big step in their life. Share with me a little bit about, do you think real estate found you because you were sort of always around it? And then you realize this is a place where you can put your passion for people. Or were you actively saying, oh, I really want to help people. And you found real estate?

Sean Valiton:  6:13  
I think a bit of both. I mean, I fell into the real estate business because of people that I surrounded myself with, but I think I was drawn to it because of the impact in people's lives. And like when we talk about waiting tables, that for me, was the crucial place in my life where I found everything that I needed to be a leader, whether that's in real estate or elsewhere, because of anticipating people's needs, making sure that clients, you know people are looking for something you're there to serve them, or trying to be able to deliver that to them, dealing with difficult people as well. Or just different expectations, setting expectations for people. There was so much that came out of waiting tables and bartending that I've taken through my whole career, whether that was real estate or whether that was something else that I got into like, from a leadership perspective, there's just so many crucial pieces of that they come into everything that I do.

Greg Farber:  7:09  
I've often felt, or, I mean, I've always felt that working in a restaurant should be sort of a coming of age thing for everyone, but I've never heard it put quite the way that you did. I've never really thought of it. I thought of it more as a life experience, and I never thought, wow, yeah, this is the moment where you you learn those leadership qualities, and you also have to learn to deal with adversity, because not every person at every table is going to be happy with you, right? 

Sean Valiton:  7:31  
Nope. 

Greg Farber:  7:31  
So there's some lessons, right?

Sean Valiton:  7:33  
You can't control it. You can't control that the kitchen is backed up. But you have to set those expectations for people.

Greg Farber:  7:38  
Right. You didn't cause the problem, but you're the face of it anyway.

Sean Valiton:  7:41  
Exactly, so you can, really, you can, you can make or break somebody's experience by setting those expectations, explaining why whatever's happening is happening, and try to continue to make it, make it good.

Greg Farber: 7:52  
And let me guess, that lesson still applies to you in today's role.

Sean Valiton:  7:55  
100%. In every you know job, or you know, pivot that I've had throughout my career that has, I've always come back to that, and having that sense which I got when I was really young, from that, that experience has really set me up to succeed, I think, in a lot of the different my whole career path, because I'm always anticipating what clients are thinking or what coworkers are thinking or how do I set proper expectations and deliver on what they're looking for?

Greg Farber:  8:27  
So how does Sean handle a situation he didn't see coming? You can anticipate what someone might need, but have you had any instances where you met a challenge that you didn't see coming and you had to overcome something really unexpected and still find a way to lead yourself, or maybe others or a company through that?

Sean Valiton:  8:45  
Sure, absolutely. I mean, it happens. It happens all the time, you know, just just, if using, you know, today's experience in general. You know, things come up a lot where we have to get involved to try to, you know, smooth it over with the client, explain, take, take ownership of the mistake or whatever it was that happened, and explain why, and then, you know, try to work them through, to keep them happy. You know, I would say, as you know, coming up like just, just finding out that we were having our first child, you know, going to a personal side of things and realizing that, you know, that wasn't necessarily planned at the time. That's a big 

Greg Farber:  9:24  
But it changes everything. 

Sean Valiton:  9:25  
It's a big pivot in life, right? But it's that roll up your sleeves, and this is, you know, this is where we are, and this is what, what you need to do in order to make sure that that things stay on the right path, and then doing it. So there's, I mean, life is filled with ups and downs and unexpected things. I think it's what you make of it and how you turn that into a positive or a negative. It's a choice, and so I've always kind of held that I always welcome challenges and as they come I use them to turn them into positives.

Greg Farber:  10:04  
A lot of times you see people that are very driven and very growth and expansion oriented and everything, but that comes out much more abrasively in their personality. And you're the absolute opposite of that. You're anything but abrasive. Um, you have this very like smooth sort of flow about you and everything, and yet you're heading up one of the biggest expansions in our bank's history, really trying to change our platform and our presence in the market. Can you talk a little bit about your entrepreneurial mindset and how you can be so forward thinking and so aggressive on a business standpoint, and yet keep that even keel?

Sean Valiton:  10:47  
Yeah, absolutely. I've always had this want to make things better and improve things. I feel like everything-

Greg Farber:  10:55  
From scratch? Or you want to take something that's broken and fix it? Or both?

Sean Valiton:  10:58  
Both but mostly broken and fix it. Like, I feel like I feel like everything can be better. And that's always kind of driven me in this way, to look at things, regardless of what it what it is, whether it's in my personal life or in business, to be able to kind of see the whole field and then figure out, Okay, where can we make things better? And and I passionately feel strongly about the fact that we can do that. And by doing that, I think that my energy around some of these things brings people along, because they understand that I'm passionate about it, and they can see what I'm talking about. And so I think it's, it's it drives me in a lot of different ways. I think being able to pull that together and then actually implement things and make sure that it's not just talk, it's not just energy, and that you're actually, you know, taking those things that you want to make better and then actually doing them, yeah, actually doing them, bringing people along, and then planning it out and then rolling them out. That's something that I've learned over time, is, and that's the most important thing, right? It's like, you can talk about all these things you want to improve. And we could do this, we could do that, but until you do it, then what's you know, it doesn't matter. 

Greg Farber:  12:09  
You mentioned pulling people along. You have to have buy in. You have to have people believing in what you're doing, but you also have to have people believing that the direction is good for the company as a whole, right? So how do you how do you kind of balance that? I have a great idea. I'm Sean. I'm passionate. This is where I want to go. With how do I make sure that this is the right thing for the company?

Sean Valiton:  12:38  
I've always had, I don't want to say I'm egoless, but I am very quick to accept other people's perspectives and views. And so I don't push on something just for the sake of pushing on something I like to if I identify something that I feel like I want to work on or that I feel like is better generally, it's in the best interest of the business. In my mind, if it turns out to not be then that's fine. We can pivot and go a different direction. But I think by bringing people along, setting the expectation on what I'm trying to do, then quickly it reveals itself on whether this is a good idea or not a good idea. If it is a good idea, people will get on board. If not, they don't. I think having the humility to be able to accept that if your idea is not the one that we should be pushing on, then move on to something different.

Greg Farber:  13:30  
Interesting. And correct me, If I'm wrong here, I'm trying to kind of glean between the lines here, but what I'm hearing is that it's different to be passionate about what you want to do versus being heavily invested in what you want to do, because if you're passionate, then you pull people along and you get your message through. But if you're too overly invested in it, then there's a cost to you admitting that maybe that idea wasn't the best, and you're saying that you don't really care about that cost. Your passion drives you, and you're not overly invested, where you're not losing sleep if the idea didn't pan out.

Sean Valiton:  14:02  
Right. Unless I feel very strongly about the idea. Like, if I feel like but, but then it's just a conversation, right? It's on getting other people to understand where I'm coming from and being invested in it. I mean, if we're, if we're moving forward with something, whether it's a new product, program, whether, whatever it is like, we need to be invested but at first, it's-

Greg Farber:  14:22  
Right. But not at a personal cost. You're not, you're not taking personal affront from your idea not working, which I think is a huge distinction, where so many people might be in a position where they're passionate about something, but then if it doesn't work out, they get incredibly frustrated,

Sean Valiton:  14:34  
Right. Yeah, yeah, I don't. I don't get that. 

Greg Farber:  14:38  
You don't get frustrated.

Sean Valiton:  14:39  
Not really. I really don't.

Greg Farber:  14:41  
I haven't seen it.

Sean Valiton:  14:41  
Yeah. I mean, because things, things pivot, things change, right? And so I don't know, the way that I look at life is, I am very, I'm having fun, and I like being surrounded by people who are motivated and excited about things, and we're all working together. To build something, and whether that's my idea, that's your idea, 

Greg Farber:  15:04  
Doesn't matter. 

Sean Valiton:  15:05  
I don't care. Yeah exactly. We're just, we're building and we're having fun together. So that's the way I kind of look at business. I look at my personal life too. And it's kind of like that's kind of the way that I think about things. 

Greg Farber:  15:19  
Well speaking of having fun then and personal life. Let's talk about that a little bit. I mentioned at the onset, you're obviously a family man. I can just tell from your persona, you're probably a wonderful dad. How do your learnings on either side? Maybe a business learning translate into family, or a family learning translate into business that allows you to, you know, balance that, that work life relationship, and really bring lessons from the one into the other but yet still keeping them separate, because they're still separate parts of your life?

Sean Valiton:  15:54  
Yeah. I mean, I could probably go both ways. I mean, obviously, you know, being a father has taught me a lot from a leadership perspective for business, and my business has taught me a lot about being a father. I think about them fairly the same in a lot of ways. Like for my kids, for instance, Stacy and I have raised the kids, you know, we install good manners in them, and want to have them do the right thing, type of attitude, bring them up, teach them the way, and then kind of treat them as people, and people make mistakes, and you kind of course correct as you go along. And it's kind of the same thing with team members in a lot of ways, where you have a group of people that you're working with, you explain or communicate on how you feel about things and how you feel like they should work, and then you trust your people to do the right thing.

Greg Farber:  16:55  
You can't necessarily change or control their personalities, but you can guide them down the right path.

Sean Valiton:  17:01  
Exactly. And I think the more you try to control people or try to change their personalities, the more you get into these toxic cultures, whether that's personal or whether that's business, where you just get these, you know, it's just counterproductive in general. And so I think it's it's I took it on myself to communicate the way that I feel. Hopefully people want to come along with that. If not, then listen to what their their perspective, and let's see if that's a better way. But it's, it's really just kind of getting everybody on the same page. And so, you know, my kids are getting older now. I have a 17 year old, a 16 year old and a 12 year old, and it's amazing watching them kind of grow, because they have their base, they're having their own experiences. And and I look at them very similar to I look at, you know, and again, I don't want to downplay my love for my children. I'm just saying-

Greg Farber:  17:54  
No, I understand, yeah, the question was intentional, right? Because there are, and we've had this before on this, that a lot of leadership lessons do come out of the personal life. And we don't all just read a book on how to be a good leader at work and then take that and go run a company. Excuse me. But you take those lessons along the way, and you pick a lot of them up in your personal time. You spend more time away from the office than in it in most cases, but yet you can apply those things. So by all means, yeah, I get the comparison.

Sean Valiton:  18:23  
Yeah. So it's good. And I think on both fronts, there's just a lot of really good momentum right now. You know, at home again, my kids are getting older. My oldest is starting to look at college, which is a pretty exciting time, obviously, another chapter in her life, and just in general. And, you know, my wife and I have a really good partnership around, you know, kind of the same thing, like, we just work really well together. We always have a common understanding. And it just, it works really good. So personally, things are great. A lot of positive momentum there. And then, business wise, you know, we're doing, it's awesome what we're doing with Leader. We have good leadership across the Bank. I think Jay does a fantastic job in stepping up and starting to empower more of the department managers. We've got a good camaraderie and good vibes across the whole organization, on building this thing together. So there's just a lot there. I think we're just at we're barely scratching the surface on the potential, on what we can offer.

Greg Farber:  19:32  
So if you're just scratching the surface, where does Sean go personally or professionally from here?

Sean Valiton:  19:39  
Let's talk professionally. I feel like I love what I'm doing at Leader. I like the team that we've built. I like all the different opportunities that we have, and not just in Residential Lending, but in all the different departments too. So I'm just keep doing what I'm doing. It's kind of cool because I. But going back to when I was in real estate and worked for a large national company, and we built a title company, oversaw some markets, but that was a really large national scale. And then when I came to Leader, I was so excited about the fact that we took it down to local and it was-

Greg Farber:  20:17  
And now you're doing the opposite. 

Sean Valiton:  20:19  
Right. So it's, really interesting, because they have experience in both sides, and so it gives me the unique perspective of being able to see both of those. And it's also taking what I loved about Leader local, and then being able to as we build, keep that feeling.

Greg Farber:  20:35  
We talk about that a lot, that as we grow and we want to have a bigger impact, but we don't want to lose that culture, that approach is a huge component of that.

Sean Valiton:  20:43  
As we start to grow and start to expand into different markets in Residential Lending, really thinking through, okay, how do we make our presence and our brand in that market truly local? By taking what we've learned in Massachusetts and what we've done here and to just kind of try to duplicate that, because a lot of the large national mortgage companies or large national companies in general don't do a good job of that, right? It's kind of like surface level.

Right, so you're just, you're always an outsider. Rather than being an insider.

And I think that the it's a very important tight rope to walk as we expand, to keep that in mind and make sure that we're taking- we're not losing that kind of soul, that's what makes us special here, and making sure that we're growing.

Greg Farber:  21:31  
So we're doing a segment this year that I'm going to go into. You were on the tightrope now you can fall off on this side or that side or jump off, perhaps is better than falling off. Couple of quick questions. Rapid fire. You tell me which one you like the best. If you feel like you want to expand on that, feel free. There's no right or wrong answer. It's just kind of a curiosity. Of like, Okay, let's see where Sean's going with this. He's told us how all of it works behind the scenes, in his brain there and now, what do you want to do? Calculated risk, or gut instinct. 

Sean Valiton  22:04  
Gut instinct.

Greg Farber:  22:05  
Okay, what about the risks?

Sean Valiton  22:07  
I mean, I think gut instinct to define the vision and then calculate a risk, to narrow it down, to make it an actual like, something that you could implement. 

Greg Farber:  22:17  
So we separate the vision from the process. 

Sean Valiton  22:19  
Yes, but I'm, but I am a vision first person. I'm a big picture thinker. And then I get back to, then I back into the details.

Greg Farber:  22:26  
Okay, now this next one, we kind of have both. So you can only pick one startup environment or established institution? 

Sean Valiton  22:33  
startup environment, 100%.

Greg Farber:  22:35  
Yeah, always? What's so exciting about that?

Sean Valiton  22:38  
I think it's that it's more the energy of the group of people. So like, I mean, Redfin, which I was involved with early on, there was 50 of us in the country. We had this amazing mission around changing the experience in the client's favor, changing the real estate game in the client's favor. Every person who worked at that company was gung ho, and we were just like, just very excited and growing. 

Greg Farber:  23:04  
So it brings the excitement and that passion you were talking about. 

Sean Valiton  23:07  
Exactly, and there's also just a lot of opportunities with that, because you've got a motivated group of people rallying around a mission, who are looking for new things to be able to to build or that help to add on to what they're doing. And so there's just the especially in something like that, where you have large funding, the opportunities are kind of endless. There's also opportunity in large institutions. But I think that large institutions are already established, large institutions, it's just the bureaucracy will drive me insane. So

Greg Farber:  23:42  
I'm sensing a bit of a theme here. So let's see where you fall between strategy and execution.

Sean Valiton  23:50  
Probably strategy.

Greg Farber:  23:51  
I kind of thought you might go that way.  It is more of that vision approach rather.

Sean Valiton  23:56  
 Yeah, it's probably one of my bigger weaknesses, is like I can very quickly determine the vision, the strategy, on how we're going to get there, but then tying the bow and making sure that the execution is proper and staying with it.

Greg Farber:  24:10  
You need those the system thinkers like myself to do the execution.

Sean Valiton  24:12  
Exactly. And that's where, that's where the team comes in, right? So it's, uh, you got to partner with the right people who who answer your weaknesses,

Greg Farber:  24:21  
Passion or purpose?

Sean Valiton  24:24  
Passion.

Greg Farber: 24:26  
So far, you're four for four with what I would have thought that you might answer this next one, I have no clue, because it's not related to the first four. Skiing or yoga?

Sean Valiton  24:34  
Skiing. 

Greg Farber:  24:35  
Yeah? Okay, because I understand that you like both very much.

Sean Valiton  24:38  
Yeah I love both. I mean, yoga helps to keep me grounded. It's obviously, you know, the exercise is amazing. I think there's something like, really, like spiritual and and about that. Skiing is kind of like, that's my free place. That's my, that's my-

Greg Farber:  24:54  
That's your happy place. That's where you can get it all out, adernaline and just go.  

Sean Valiton  24:57  
Completely free. Yep, exactly, yeah. 

Greg Farber:  24:59  
So you've been doing it for a long time?

Sean Valiton  25:00  
I've been skiing since I was young, yeah, which is funny, because my parents didn't ski, and my mom used to drive me to the mountain, and she would just sit and read while I went out and skied. 

Greg Farber:  25:11  
Oh, no way. 

Sean Valiton  25:11  
And so it was kind of my release to get away from, you know, from my town and from school and stuff like that. So I just always loved it. And then I stopped skiing for 20 years, maybe 15. And then when the kids got a little bit older, my wife is from Tennessee too, so she had never skied, maybe once or twice, but then we just kind of went all in and brought them up to the mountains, and we started skiing, and they all love it. My youngest daughter is on the race team up Attitash. So we ski every weekend. I love it.

Greg Farber: 25:42  
Yeah, my parents skied cross country when I was growing up. So I grew up skiing cross country, and anytime we would pass, like a real, like a ski mountain for downhill, I would always beg and plead, can we go? Can we go? And it was same thing. They didn't want to go. And, yeah, we didn't own the skis. We'd have to rent or whatever. So they'd be like, Okay, fine, we'll get you, like, the afternoon pass, let you go for a couple hours. And I absolutely love it, but somehow, still, for me, at its core there, there's that, that peaceful, meditative thing about the the cross country skiing, you're just silent gliding in the woods, which maybe speaks to why you like the the yoga, too. There's that peaceful aspect to it. There's something Zen about gliding through the woods.

Sean Valiton  26:17  
Yeah and it settles me down. It settles my mind down. And then obviously, the just the physical exercise piece of it, it's amazing how difficult and how like strenuous yoga can be. But you feel amazing afterwards, and it's good. I think it's also too it's an approachable exercise as you age that helps to keep you younger.

Greg Farber:  26:38  
Okay, so not a large barrier to entry. Just grab a mat and show up. 

Sean Valiton  26:43  
Yeah.  

Greg Farber:  26:44  
Maybe I should try it.

Sean Valiton  26:45  
Yeah, you should.

Greg Farber: 26:46  
I need some more inner calm in my life.

Sean Valiton  26:48  
It's important.

Greg Farber:  26:54  
All right, one more segment we'll do real quick here. We actually asked you, when we talked about having you come on the show to do a bit of homework and bring something with you that inspires you, could be anything. So we're very excited to see what you brought today and what inspires Sean.

Sean Valiton  27:08  
Okay, so I had a couple different things I was thinking about, but I brought this pen. 

Greg Farber: 27:12  
Okay.

Sean Valiton  27:13  
So this pen is my was my father's okay, my dad, he died about two years ago, and it's, it's engraved with his name on it. And so this was a gift from one of his managers. He was in travel. He was an operations manager, and it was gifted to him by one of his managers at the time. But I'm gonna take a little turn here. So what's interesting is, like, probably a few months after he was gifted this pen, he was laid off because the travel industry was changing, right?

Greg Farber:  27:46  
So they were giving out gifts, and then they're like, nope, see ya later.

Sean Valiton  27:49  
Exactly, but what's motivating to me about this pen, number one it's my dad's, and that, from a personal perspective, it's important, and he held it and everything else. But from a from a business perspective, it keeps- This is strange, but I'm always thinking about how things are evolving and changing, because when you think back to the travel business, and he had a long, successful career, but then all these mergers and acquisitions started happening, and the travel business essentially went away, you know, because of the internet. And he never quite recovered from that, because he stopped working in the travel industry, started doing something totally different. And so it keeps me motivated to keep thinking through, like, what's coming next, or, how do we adjust? How do we adapt to whatever is changing in the industry? 

Greg Farber:  28:33  
A reminder to stay nimble. 

Sean Valiton  28:34  
Yeah, yeah, exactly. 

Greg Farber:  28:36  
I like it, yeah. 

Sean Valiton  28:37  
And I mean, it's an important piece. I mean, we'll see how long before I lose it. 

Greg Farber:  28:40  
Does it usually just live in a special place at home? Or do you keep you carry it around? 

Sean Valiton  28:43  
No, I use it. I use it every day. 

Greg Farber:  28:44  
No way. 

Sean Valiton  28:45  
We'll see. At some point I'm sure it'll disappear. 

Greg Farber: 28:49  
No, it won't disappear. Well, Sean, this has been fantastic. I really appreciate you coming on today. Any parting thoughts, words of wisdom for the next generation of lending leaders that are, that are coming up anything you want to share?

Sean Valiton  29:03  
No. I mean, I think, I think just in general, just the momentum that we have as a team at Leader, the leadership, where we're going, it's just very exciting. And I hope that everybody feels that way. I think that the team that we've built, not just Residential Lending, but again, across the Bank, we have so many smart, motivated, excited people, and we're kind of rallying around this, this mission and, and, you know, Jay and Sushil as leaders and the brand, and it's just a lot there. And so I hope that everybody's excited, as I am, about it, and and looking forward to seeing kind of where we can take it.

Greg Farber:  29:41  
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